Also, you must have a built-in circuit breaker to prevent a short circuit from causing permanent damage to the power supply or the trains. He directs production at Lionel, the premier model train manufacturer, and he istheformer president of theConrail HistoricalSociety. The other type of cars are the Scale cars, which are exact or near-exact replicas of actual freight cars. I have purchased diodes to put into the older transformers to see if this resolves the issue with newer tenders. The larger transformers could operate up to four trains independently. Lionel Rolling Stock Identification Guide. For a passenger train with lighted cars, getting a little more power isnt a bad idea. Not wanting to give up, I experimented with an 80 watt modern Lionel transformer and got great results. Lionel makes a seemingly infinite number of cars to in a variety of colors, types, and road names. Lionel has a new 180 watt transformer due out soon that will be a nice upgrade. Unless I'm all wet it sounded like there are somecompatibilityissues with certain locomotives versus manufacturer's transformer output wave forms. Effort. Lionel makes two expansion sets for this purpose. Not really a how-to-build-a-layout book, but it is a good general introduction to the hobby full of interesting stuff. How do you choose the right power supply for your model trains? UpBright 18V AC/DC Adapter Compatible with Lionel O Gauge Fastrack 10" Remote Control Terminal Straight LionChief System Track 6-1923100 HKYF45-180230T-US DC18V 2300mA 18VDC Power Supply Cord Charger. That means there are lots of them. If you add feeders to the track at the farthest point (remember to get the same wire to the same rails) you will not slow down at the farthest point. All Lionel transformer comparisons should include the common 1033, RW, LW, KW and ZW transformers. Obviously, for a lot of people, the $700 Lionel ZW-L transformer is overkill. If youre comfortable doing some work yourself, you can buy a fixer-upper, and my informational links will tell you more about fixing one yourself. Just not quite as much. Get the newest photos, videos, stories, and more from Trains.com brands. They're controlled with a simple handheld remote control and run on easy-to-connect plastic track. In the middle range, Lionel made a lot of other transformers. If you are wiring with a common rail for your blocks, then keeping the common rail the same color all the time while changing the color for the other rail in each block is also an option. We use cookies to ensure that we give you the best experience on our website. This would be more than enough for any single train and a few accessories. I thought an ENGINEER was the guy driving the train? Because the runs are short and power demands so low, this fine wire poses no safety threat. I know my train club had an issue with conventional locomotives not running properly on a layout with DCS and TMCC and apparently solved it by replacing a Lionel transformer with an MRC transformer that puts out a pure sine wave. In some cases. They run on three rail track. Here are a few: --The Lionel Fastrack Book, by Robert Schleicher. Here are a couple examples: As you can see, with a bit of experimentation and imagination, numerous different track layouts can be created. It was a symbiotic relationship, the engineer designed it and the tech built it, then they both troubleshot it. The multi-conductor wire is also available. This has the added advantage that Lionel TMCC (command control) will operate correctly. QUOTE: by Skyray "Typical engineer--you need a technician. Please see our article on Fastrack here for more information. IF the Engineer is the guy that drives the locomotive then theTechnician must be the fireman is this correct? This drawing illustrates all of the key functionality of a Lionel KW transformer. But after a little while, you will likely want your train to do more, and youll start thinking along these lines: --It sure would be neat if it did more than run in a circle. Interested in southest Pennsylvania railroads; [:)]. As cheap as the 1033 is, if youre going to buy a transformer, you might as well pay a few dollars more to get a 1033. Sell Your Trains To A Train Dealer or a Single Buyer. Model train power falls into one of three categories. Accessories often interact with the train, such as a crossing gate that lowers as the train passes. the amount of track is not what is important here. Lots of good information for building any size O Gauge layout. Lest I offend, in another plane of existence I was an electronics tech. Smaller layouts (a typical 4 foot by 8 foot being a good example) can usually get by with Number16 since the length of the run from the power supply to the track is never more than a few feet. It will require a minimum of 108' of track just to do a basic rectangle before I add any switches, etc. This is a old school approach for sizing cables & transformers or appliances in the electrical trade, & has never let us down. Wire gauges are coded by their size. It is much easier to be ready ahead of time then to have to do some changes afterwards. Replies and comments they make will be collapsed/hidden by default. It is 5" long. You could have a poor connection that caused the wire to heat up. I have a basement that offers an 18" concrete ledge that goes around the entire perimeter of the house that lends itself perfectly to a neat layout. You must be signed in to continue. Service/Tested $55.00 1 bid $14.06 shipping 1d 6h LIONEL TYPE (KW) TRAINMASTER TRANSFORMER FOR PARTS OR RESTORATION $17.05 4 bids $19.95 shipping 9h 23m Also, you wont be able to take advantage of independent control of multiple engines on the same track without a digital controller. Many load and unload freight from specially designed cars as well. Classic Toy Trains magazine offers information about toy trains operating and collecting, toy train product news and reviews, toy train layout tips, toy train layout designs and track plans, and more. Ill try to find a link to it for you. If you have a starter set and have had thoughts like this, youre not alone. Mark. If you continue to use this site we will assume that you are happy with it. You don't want to try to solder even Number 16 gauge wire right to your rails, however. They are fun to have. They give a true 180 watts and have excellent electronic breakers. Today, with some luck, you can get one for closer to $100. is always one of the first questions asked when someone starts to build a model railroad. converting a 2-rail freight car to 2-rail with Atlas trucks, My Triple Level Layout -FREEBIE UPDATE- 3/2/23, Successful Open House Upstate (NY) Model Railroaders, FS: Lionel MPC and modern traditional size rolling stock. Connecticut Valley Railroad -- A Branch of the New York, New Haven, And Hartford. Improve ready-to-run freight cars with a little paint. That could also be the reason the other transformers don't work. Older transformers I had this issue with are RW, 1033, KW, ZW.newer transformers were all made by MTH. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-watt Lionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. By clicking Accept All Cookies, you agree to the storing of cookies on your device to enhance site navigation, analyze site usage, and assist in our marketing efforts. Three conductor wire is common for household use. Alternating current (AC) is the preferred power for most O Gauge three-rail trains as well as some two-rail systems in smaller scales. Sign-up for email today! It is important to remember that the real test of the power supply is the load you'll place on it. Different wiring projects call for different standards. I have one R transformer from which I run everything - but only 1 train at a time and a few accessories for a layout in a space about 24 by 10 ft. Number 26 to 20 wire (depending on the length of your bus) will be sufficient for most applications. If mixing both non-command as well as command engines, both by the way will run without any thing other than the appropriate transformer, it really depends on the budget. While better starter sets usually include a more robust transformer, as a general rule the power pack supplied with your starter set is just thata start. As the kit grows and you start putting in turnouts (or the point switching systems) to move your train from one track to another track, you will not only need more than 1 transformer, you will. These sets use a remote control which talks directly to a receiver in the locomotive. Ryan developsmodeltrainlayouts for public andprivate display. If you were to get a ZW 275 you need external short protection. Lionel Ready-to-Play is a large sized train that's made to be affordable and easy-to-use for both kids and adults alike. Our transformer sizing calculator allows you to obtain the minimum single or three-phase transformer size required based on the load you need to power. As time goes on you can add higher wattage bricks one by one. However, if you begin adding more than 1 or 2 cars, be sure to get some extra track, or your longer train will be chasing its tail very quickly. As the motor takes in more electricity, the arm turns faster and faster. Another classic is the Automatic Gateman. Mike, The size of the transformer is dictated by what you want to run, the more you run the more power you will need. Big Ed Railroad Tycoon Many will still run on the track in your starter set, but because they are scale sized, the bodies of these cars may be slightly wider and longer than those in your set. I thought you wanted information related to your layout not operations at a trains show. (Use buss/feeder lines to distribute power.) Mike to the forum. Thus an appliance with a 15-ampere plug (the usual kind with parallel blades) must draw no more than 12 amperes. Although I am an electrical engineer, I just add stuff until the transformer gets too warm and then I branch off and add another. What do I need to do that with? Never had a problem. Past,presentand future. David, looking at your layout I notice there is a two rail and a three rail ? :-). How to open tamper resistant outlets, Xxcopy vs Xcopy: Command line copy utilities, Where to connect the red wire to a light switch, Brains 25 cents: The story behind the meme. The Lionel motor is a collection of four electromagnetic plates with a rotating sweeper arm called a brush. A rule of thumb from the elders, (I had to go to the mountain top for this one), Add 2 more watts for Spankybird's fun-filled layout! That might work, but it's probably borderline, especially if you are using something like a 1033 transformer that tops out at 16 volts. Are you looking for a product or serviceif so, then read this BEFORE you post! What size Lionel transformer do I need? For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. You can't count on a lack of compatibility issues for one Legacy locomotive being definitive for all Legacy locomotives, for example. Ryan Kunkle is a nationally recognized professional model train expert and writer with over 25 years of experience. OTTS Founder Lionel and other train manufacturers have worked hard to make adding to a set easy, affordable, and fun. I recently acquired a beautiful Lionel NH Alco 420. The Lionel RW also happens to be a great transformer for Marx or American Flyer trains too, when you connect the track leads to the B and U posts instead of the A and U posts youd normally use for most Lionel setups. Lionel introduced a few LionChief Plus 2.0 starter sets in 2022. Also, I found an old guide printed by lionel on power requirements. All members here are welcome to drop in and visit. Trainz carries a variety of books that build upon the information listed above. EXPLORE FasTrack 10" Straight Track 4-Pack 6-12032 $ 21.99 FasTrack Grade Crossing with Flashers 6-12052 $ 99.99 FasTrack O36 Curved Track 4-Pack 6-12033 $ 21.99 Legacy AMC-2 Motor Controller White and black are common selections. Just connect the jumper wires to the same connections on the back of your transformer as your original connections, and make sure that the wires are not crossed. A lot of people are using the MTH Z1000's who have smaller layouts while others have moved up to the MTH Z4000. Transformer sizing for new systems Most people start with a pre-packaged train set. The 190-wattLionel KWwas the second biggest and second best transformer of the postwar era. The iconic and legendary 270-watt Lionel ZW was the biggest and best transformer Lionel made in the postwar era. I recently read an article/product review in the OGR magazine for the new Lioneltransformerand wassurprisedto learn that not all voltage outputwave-formsare created equal (pure sine wave versus some type of clipped sine wave). TRANSFORMERS ransformers were issued by Lionel thoughout the Post War period. The transition section (#12040) allows you to connect conventional O Gauge track to FasTrack. --I wish I had some more cars to put behind the engine. This diagram shows all of the controls and the pinout for the Lionel RW transformer. If you're experiencing problems with your wiring due to humidity, for example, you are going to face even greater issues with the trains and tracks themselves. A model railroad train set designed for use in the United States will have a 115V AC 60Hz power requirement. For a transformer less or equal to 500 kilovolt-amperes, a typical %Z impedance may vary between 2.3% and 5.2% based on the voltage level. The same is true for other electronic projects around your layout and inside buildings, train cars, and even locomotives. The locomotives are battery-powered and made of durable plastic. Ive talked more about the KW here. If you found this post informative or helpful, please share it! Just get a Lionel #12053 Accessory wire set and enough extra wire to connect from the wire set back to your transformer [speaker wire works well]. The first is the traditional or classic size, which are the cars that match starter sets. to run conventional you will need Legacy plus a Powermaster and Powermaster Bridge or Legacy and a TPC 300/400. Faq No: 1029 I have had the same problem. Most two-rail track systems use direct current (DC). My question is.how big of a transformer will I need to power this thing? These can all have uses for your layout. Electric Trains make great power supplies, depending on usage, on a DCS controlled layout. Its expensive, but the same factors that drove KW prices down are also driving ZW prices down. A solid and stranded wire of the same gauge will be the same total diameter. It can run four tracks at one time, so you layout can grow. Adding lights to buildings, streets, and other scenic accessories usually do not require anywhere near the amperage demand of the trains themselves. Solid wire is preferable as it is much easier to solder to the rails. Hello All: Another simple way of doing it, Only load the transformer to 75% of it's capacity, or take your total load & multiply by 125% for proper transformer sizing. Will get a Z4000 one day [this summer probably, unless I find a good deal on an older ZW] just to say I have one. Controlled Magnetics has the manufacturing experience, knowledge, and facilities to repair a wide variety of electrical power transformers. The Lionel ZW is Lionel's most iconic transformer of the 1950s and 1960s, and perhaps one of its most iconic products, period. I don't want to buy a lot more track, but then find out the transformer is too weak, if that make sense. Fortunately, in the early 21st century it is easier to expand your starter set than ever before. Length of track or type of track doesn't (or shouldn't) matter. The preferred choice for wiring control panels is telephone or telecommunications wire. It will require a minimum of 108' of track just to do a basic rectangle before I add any switches, etc. The Lionel 1033 can be used for small or medium-sized layouts. But a 12-gauge solid wire is one strand, while a 12-gauge stranded wire may be made up of more than a dozen much smaller individual strands spun together. Here at Trainz, we carry all of the products you will need to go from a starter set to a miniature railroad empire. 10 Easy Ways to Improve a Christmas Train Display, Wiring a Model Railroad for Block Operation, How to Build and Wire Reverse Loops for Model Trains, How to Choose the Right Transformer for Your Model Trains, Compatibility of Different Model Train Brands, HO Scale Track Plans for Model Train Layouts, buildings, streets, and other scenic accessories. Used 1033's for sidings and the switching yard its self. Turn on the throttle, then short the A and U posts (in the case of Lionel) or variable and base posts (in the case of Flyer) with a screwdriver or a piece of wire for a maximum of five seconds. They are fun to have. Below weve listed these transformers in numerical order in the Numerical Index. Get updates and special offers via email from Trains.com brands! The modern equivalent is the Lionel CW-80, but frankly I like the old ones better. ransformers were issued by Lionel thoughout the Post War period. If you want a station for your trains to stop at, there are both station platforms [#24159] as well as full sized stations [#14257]. It is also a good idea to run your accessories off of a separate power supply and wire grid from the trains themselves. For instance, a 100 kilovolt-ampere transformer with 8.32 kilovolts (or less) on the high side has a typical value of 2.6% impedance. what size lionel transformer do i need. This conserves the trains' power supply for their needs and makes troubleshooting much easier. Lots of good tips for building a layout from two of the most experienced people in the hobby. For Lionel power the 45 watts is good for a 4 by 8 as a rule of thumb to compensate poor track you just use more feeders. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. Lionel, LLC continued to manufacture and market trains and accessories in O scale under the Lionel brand and S gauge under the American Flyer brand. To determine the required transformer VA, multiply the secondary voltage by the required amperes: For example, VA=Volts x Amperes or 28V x 1.2 amperes = 33.6 VA. To determine the maximum transformer current, divide the transformer VA by transformer secondary voltage. Pretty much suffered the same fate, too. Choosing a selection results in a full page refresh. You can use bus and feeder wires to more evenly distribute the power over your track. While those locomotives and their sound systems are designed to operate using conventional transformers like your ZW, digital controllers are needed to activate additional features like special sound effects and coupler activation. This will spread the load of your lighted passenger consist across the two transformers. When they were manufactured by The American Flyer Manufacturing Company, they were made in Standard Gauge and a version of "O" gauge. Best bang for the buck for command are the Lionel 180W Powerhouse bricks IMO. It's expensive, but the same factors that drove KW prices down are also driving ZW prices down. I've read that it is good practice to add feeders every 10 sections of track or sothat seems like a lot but I suppose that beats having "dead" spots in the track. The load voltage and load amps must be known to calculate KVA rating. Sell Your Trains Yourself At Train Shows. The 1044 is just a 1033 in a different case. The polarities can be reversed to change the direction of the train. That was before all the technician assemby work was outsourced overseas and they left the poor engineers to fend for themselves. The larger wire is usually more expensive and more challenging to work with. Wow.thanks for all the advice so far, guys!! First, a few general notes about choosing wire. But Lionel now produces four Track Expansion Sets, which expand this basic loop into something more exciting. Digital command control systems (DCC) uses digital information to control the electrical power to the train. My question is this in order that this doesn't happen again what type of transformer would you recommend? The Lionel ZW has four sets of posts and six controls. This type of transformer is cheap, its reliable, and its easy to find. Lionel Model Railroad and Train Transformers Lionel Model Railroad and Train Transformers Best Selling Lionel 1908080 O Gauge CW80 Transformers - Black (4) $147.85 New $110.00 Used Lionel Legacy Powermaster Lnl637146 (13) $134.99 New $90.00 Used Lionel 634120 TMCC Direct Lock-On Transformer - Silver (21) $58.99 New $49.99 Used Enter your e-mail address to subscribe to this blog and receive notifications of new posts by e-mail. While it is tempting to go with the biggest wire possible to guarantee excess capacity, there are drawbacks to putting in more than you need. We use cookies to ensure that we give you the best experience on our website. To determine the maximum transformer current, divide the transformer VA by transformer secondary voltage. This is because the demands for power are becoming more than your transformer can handle. I'm not sure I completely understand your question. I use to use one KW for 70 feet of main line, sidings and switching yard entry track. There is the 12030 Figure-8 set, which along with the track included in your set makes your layout into this: Figure-8s are great because they create a crossing, giving the appearance of a railroad junction, they break up the oval, and the parts to create them are relatively cheap. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Tales From Harmon Shops, WTB: LIONEL AUTRORACKS SPECIFICALLY SOUTHERN,GRAND TRUNK,BNSF,FERROMEX. For more realistic operation, you need some kind of speed control (throttle) between the 10340 Automatic Reversing Unit and your transformer. I talk more in depth about the 1033 here. Anyway if it takes me 100 years to finish this thing one thing is for sure I will not have to worry about powering anything and everything. Smaller feeder wires are used to bridge the small gap from the bus to the track. electronically controlled outputs. RemembertheVeterans. These bus wires are often more important than the size of the power supply itself in getting good results. It states: 1.25 amps for each motor, 0.2 amps for each bulb. Price Received. Ran 6 motors [MPC's]. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. Of all the questions fielded by the staff of Classic Toy Trains, inquiries regarding layout wiring top the list.While you might expect numerous questions regarding complex techniques or new technologies, CTT. From 25 Watts to 275 Watts, a Lionel transformer could be found for every power requirment from simple circles of track to extensive railroads.